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How to make a 2AP charakter viable?

How to make a 2AP charakter viable?

Postby Grupsi » Wed Apr 05, 2017 7:55 am

Hey, i am a GM for a small group of friends.

One of my PCs has only 2AP and wants to focus on unarmedcombat.

Do you guys have an idea how to make him viable? Because of the rules he would not be able to hinder an opponet on leaving his grapple.

My idea was to give him a combatsyle bonus where he doesn't have to use an AP to oppose a break free action. (with an storry arc and as a reward)

Any other ideas?
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Re: How to make a 2AP charakter viable?

Postby Matt_E » Wed Apr 05, 2017 9:27 am

Hmm. I would be leery of that sort of mod, offhand, though I have not thought it through with care. Off the top of my head:

If he's a mystic-warrior type (kung-fu monk), give him Enhance Action Points.

You could let him retcon the character slightly, to boost INT+DEX high enough to get 3 AP. It's a bit of minmaxing, but if it's seen as so important to the character's idiom as to possibly warrant rules changes, then that says to me that the character in the player's mind wasn't characterized quite right. I would allow some retroactive tweaking, in that case. Live and learn.

BTW, I suppose you mean he can't keep a Grappled opponent with 3 AP from breaking away. To me, that's just the rules working as intended. A foe with 3 AP is just plain quicker than you, and can do more. It is a significant advantage, period. Against such a foe, this PC would need to use a different tactic.

Finally, I'm a bit surprised that this PC has only 2 AP. With an average INT of 13 and an average DEX of 10.5 (10 or 11), you're already close to the threshold for 3 AP... (Then again, I don't know your character-generation scheme. Maybe you disallow shifting points.) If this character's idiom is the hulking but dumb and clumsy bruiser, then I think a quick-witted/nimble opponent should enjoy some advantage against his crushing holds.
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Re: How to make a 2AP charakter viable?

Postby Grupsi » Wed Apr 05, 2017 9:54 am

He is a brute from the forrest ^^ and he is a bit unlucky with his dice :/

Thats the reason why we don't want to give him just +1 AP. I was talking to the player and he is ok with it to have 1 AP less than the averange.

BUT, I find the grappling rules quite odd. Because it's a default win if the other charakter does not have a AP left. A unopposed brawn check or what ever would also be interesting.
My few on the toppic is that if you have somone in your grip, you don't need to react that active to an attempt to flee if the oter person isn't strong or skilled enough.

What other tactics would you other wise suggest?

We are relaively new to Mythras/RQ, so we don't know much about the system and possible shinanigans you can do with it. We are also more of the "fun" and "RPG" group, ususallly we need several sessions to get to an combatencounter.

Edit: one word "know"
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Re: How to make a 2AP charakter viable?

Postby AmazingOnionMan » Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:29 pm

There is the detail that if a combatant doesn't have an AP to spend, the action will be treated as a failure. It says nothing about the opponent automatically succeeding. "If the grappled victim wins [..an opposed test], they manage to break free". Two failures - status quo; "A grapple continues until the victim manages to break free."
A grappled victim will also potentially soak up massive penalties with limb immobilization, easily giving an edge to the aggressor and allowing others to pile up on him.

Also, look at this thread: http://designmechanism.freeforums.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1947
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Re: How to make a 2AP charakter viable?

Postby Grupsi » Thu Apr 06, 2017 9:05 am

Ah, now i feel stupid ^^.

Thank you for pointing that out.

The rules make more sense now.
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Re: How to make a 2AP charakter viable?

Postby Matt_E » Thu Apr 06, 2017 10:31 am

AmazingOnionMan wrote:There is the detail that if a combatant doesn't have an AP to spend, the action will be treated as a failure. It says nothing about the opponent automatically succeeding.


That's a really good point. I forgot about that.

I think some confusion over that subtlety may arise because one can use the Withdraw SE to automatically get away, without rolling, unlike the Struggle CA. However, the Change Range CA also requires a roll, which is consistent with Struggle.
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Re: How to make a 2AP charakter viable?

Postby Pete » Thu Apr 06, 2017 1:12 pm

Actually you the intent is that the Withdraw SE allows you to disengage, _except_ when you are Entangled, Gripped, or Pinned.
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Re: How to make a 2AP charakter viable?

Postby raleel » Thu Apr 06, 2017 4:28 pm

I would suggest a big shield and passive warding and armor on the locations he doesn't generally block. This forces them to choose location to get by the shield, which forces them onto armor that may be strong. Shields are also nice for punching people.

I suggest stun location, however you can, as that can neuter action points pretty well. Also focus on doing overextend opponent, as that can make action points irrelevant. Trip opponent is good because it forces a penalty which can make defense unimportant. Unarmed also has access to grip (grapple as a special effect), stun location, and take weapon. The latter often represents a way to drop their skill to very low levels.

Always outmaneuver against multiple foes. To that end, he should be good with brawn, unarmed, and evade. He has to be very good with 2 AP. Nothing wasted.
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Re: How to make a 2AP charakter viable?

Postby nDervish » Fri Apr 07, 2017 3:54 am

Matt_E wrote:I think some confusion over that subtlety may arise because one can use the Withdraw SE to automatically get away, without rolling, unlike the Struggle CA. However, the Change Range CA also requires a roll, which is consistent with Struggle.


Note, however, that Change Range automatically succeeds, without a roll, if your opponent does not spend an AP to oppose the change of range:

Two methods are available to do this... (2) Change Range Combat Action – costs an Action Point, and is used on a character’s Turn.

In the latter case of attempting to Change Range, the character’s opponent has two options, described below. In both cases if the opponent has no Action Points left – or chooses not to spend an Action Point – then the attempt to close is automatically successful.


(This is under "Closing Range" on p.107, but "Opening Range", immediately following, says that it works the same way, so the reference being an "attempt to close" rather than "attempt to open" is not significant.)

Of course, this is easily fixed by disallowing Change Range actions when grappled and requiring the opponent to use Struggle to break free first.
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Re: How to make a 2AP charakter viable?

Postby raleel » Fri Apr 07, 2017 5:31 am

An additional thought on this - I can see this working if he takes on a more passive role. He doesn't attack first, because he has to get inside range. So, he defends and uses the close range special effect. Now that he's inside reach, many foes are going to be at a disadvantage, as they will likely have an M reach weapon. This is the point where he then does the grapple and prevents the range changing.

Now, they attack, but they are reduced in damage. That or they Struggle.
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